Shorts and to the Point: Erica Rose’s GIRL TALK is an attention-worthy look at female sexuality in the “in-between”

One of a couple short films that struck me in a major way at this year’s aGLIFF (All Genders, Lifestyles, and Identities Film Festival) in Austin, Erica Rose’s GIRL TALK is a look at how one young woman navigates her way through her world and her relationships, sexually and emotionally. As Rose says, it is about the “in between”. It isn’t about the lead character coming out, or coming to terms with herself and her sexuality, or facing the repercussions of delving into the same-sex world. Again, as Rose states, “This is a story about queer people just living.” Therefore, by design, what is exceptional about the film isn’t a crisis about her situation or her journey. No, what is exceptional is that rarely do we get such a direct, unapologetic in its sexual-politics, view of this world, not to mention an exploration of the gulf that sometimes exists between physical and emotional intimacy – without hanging onto a tragic moment or stock hurdle to overcome. The filmmaking is as assured as the lead character is when she is on her game, and the patience to breathe in between the “in between” Rose speaks of, makes the moments land with that much more of an impact.

GIRL TALK is awash in female sexuality (not just in the queer community) in a way that might confound some people that aren’t looking for a depiction of it that refuses to “avert its eyes” or justify or explain the characters’ behavior and actions via familiar tropes. If it is familiar, then you likely know those characters or you are one of them, or have an admirable take on those outside your immediate social/gender/sexual/whatever circle. And if you are not – like me – then you just might be electrified by the filmmaking voice you’ve just discovered because the characters are dynamic and true, the filmmaking has style and touch, and you don’t have see these women as personal avatars to be connected to them.

1 You have said that you “continuously question the heteronormative, white, patriarchal definitions of relationships that we’re conditioned to accept. These contrived expectations also feed into how we internalize gay identities in media. Gay stories are diminished to center on two central issues: the coming out story or an intoxicating, doomed relationship. Where are the stories in between? I know I’m hungry for that and I strongly believe my audience is too.”

So, with that being said, you set up a clear mission to achieve storytelling-wise – within the constraints of a short film, no less, with GIRL TALK. Can you describe the toughest aspect of meeting that challenge – maybe in ways you did not anticipate – both in writing the script, and then making sure you got it “right” in the editing process?

Before making GIRL TALK, I had never made an acutely personal film. After years of writing what I felt were unfulfilling scripts, I felt that in order to advance as an artist, I needed to tackle uncomfortable and painful moments from my own experiences. Many of my references, masterpieces of queer cinema, were centered on the coming out story or a secret relationship. Those stories are valid and need to be told, but I came out 7 years ago and I’ve never had a relationship I had to hide for fear of persecution. Yet, I am dealing with issues of intimacy and sex that are unique to my community and need an outlet too.

GIRL TALK is about the Brooklyn queer femme community and it’s made by the people who are part of it. It was really important to me to tell GIRL TALK with as much candidness, accuracy and vulnerability as possible. I’ve seen representations of queer femme sex on camera that’s either delicate, revelatory or novel. It’s by and for male viewers. The fact is those representations simply don’t portray the complexity and diversity of how our community has sex.

In the early drafts of the script, the story was so close to my true life experiences that it wasn’t palatable to a cohesive narrative. It was also far more graphic, which just wasn’t necessary. Chelsea Moore, my producing partner, worked with me on the script to give the film the emotional tenor that wasn’t initially as prominent.

Our editor Catie Stickels was able to synthesize the pace and tone masterfully. Through the editing process we were able to pinpoint the necessary beats to communicate the story as tightly and effectively as possible. Throughout the writing, shooting, and editing process I was careful in balancing realistic and vulnerable sexual interactions without veering into exploitation. I’ll say pretty confidently that we achieved that!

Hannah Hodson in GIRL TALK

2 As someone that is always focused on the utilization of color schemes and the use of color palettes on film, I was very appreciative of how you and cinematographer Daisy Zhou artfully utilized color throughout the film. Can you describe how the two of you worked together to achieve that and list any major references as far as other films or artists, etc. to get there?

Thank you! All of my work as a director uses color to help the audience understand the internal emotional states of the protagonists. With GIRL TALK there is so much our hero Mia isn’t saying, yet the color and mood of each scene is a constant reminder that she cannot escape what she’s implicitly feeling. On a personal level, when I look back at my own experiences, I remember certain events through the lens of a particular color. I wanted this to be true of Mia as well – erotic moments in red, isolating moments in blue, fantastical moments in gold, rejection and discomfort in green, and moments of revelation in purple.

One of the reasons I chose Daisy as my DP was that in all of her previous work she utilized color in similar ways. She and I went back and forth on references that were unapologetic with color – Gaspar Noe’s LOVE, Dee Rees’ PARIAH, Wong Kar-wai’s IN THE MOOD FOR LOVE, Zhang Yimou’s RAISE THE RED LANTERN, Andrew Dosunmu’s MOTHER OF GEORGE, and Aoife McArdle’s KISSING CANDICE.

I also have to mention that our production designer Madeline Wall was instrumental in our color story. She was the first creative department head attached to the project and she and I worked through every scene of the film determining what colors we should emphasize. While Daisy spearheaded the lighting, Maddie used practical lights and subtle design elements to execute the color story.

3 There is a lot on nudity and sexual situations in the film. Considering the fact that this is a short film and not a feature, how did you convince your actors to do the film (In other words, do you think that made it an easier or tougher “sale”?) and can you go into detail regarding your approach and process during filming to keep them comfortable and maintain their trust in you as the director?

Chelsea and I talked about this a lot in our casting process. The actors needed to trust me and the vision. Hannah Hodson, who plays Mia, was a friend of mine and she was attached to play Mia for about a year and a half before we actually shot the film. Not only is Hannah a brilliant actor, she understood and is part of the queer femme Brooklyn scene. It was important to me that I had a lead who was familiar with the world I was building. I had seen Kea Trevett (Kate), Erica Pappas (Elle), and Diane Chen (Natasha) in wonderful theatrical productions and independent films. I set up meetings with them to pitch GIRL TALK. I had zero issue convincing any actor to do the film, which surprised me! They all understood my approach and knew that this was a story important to tell. I want to give a major shout out to our Casting Director Matthew Glasner. Matt worked incredibly hard to secure everyone’s deal and helped us find Alia Guidry (Soleil) and Lio Mehiel (Carter). Matt, Chelsea and I also wrote specific nudity riders for each actor (in a sex scene) so that everyone knew what was happening or not happening and what was being seen or not being seen. This allowed each actor to actively consent to what we were shooting. We rehearsed each sex scene before we shot, had a closed set, and had a wonderful wardrobe, hair and make-up team to take care of our actors.

GIRL TALK

4 The film benefited by sponsorship from The Film Collaborative and a fundraising effort on Seed & Spark. Pretending that no one has ever heard of either of those entities, can you describe exactly what they did for you and the film to help get it made?

Seed & Spark is a crowdfunding platform that focuses on independent filmmakers and underrepresented voices. Seed & Spark offers partnerships with fiscal sponsors including The Film Collaborative. The Film Collaborative is the first non-profit, full-service provider dedicated to the distribution of independent film, including narrative features, documentaries and shorts. In order to secure bigger monetary donations, we worked with The Film Collaborative to make each Seed & Spark donation tax deductible. We raised over $20,000 with Seed & Spark and the help of our Executive Producers Abby Pucker, Ali Clark, and Paige Grand Pré. Chelsea and I self-financed the remainder of the budget.

5 GIRL TALK is enjoying a fantastic film festival run thus far and you have had the opportunity now to watch the film with a few different audiences. Has that experience been what you anticipated it to be, and has there been any reactions to the film that genuinely surprised you?

Thank you! We’ve been thrilled with the reception so far. Any director can tell you that showing your film to an audience for the first time is absolutely terrifying and exhilarating, but mostly terrifying, HA! We premiered at OUTFEST with a mostly young, queer-skewing audience. The reception was incredible and many people came up to us relating to the content. With the more regional festivals like Denver’s Cinema Q and the North Carolina Gay and Lesbian festival, the audience was a bit older. Even with the generational divide, people are responding positively to the film.

During some of our screenings, there were moments where the audience burst out into laughter in scenes that weren’t supposed to be funny, necessarily. I think a lot of the laughter stems from discomfort. We are taking the audience for a ride. I love it. Any emotion you feel after watching this film is valid and the more reactions the better.

Also, so many people have come up to us afterwards and were like “I knew it was going to be a sexy movie, but I wasn’t prepared for how sad it was going to be!” That’s exhilarating for me. I love playing with people’s expectations and pre-conceived notions and that’s evident in the film and its reaction.